?

Log in

No account? Create an account

New discussion topic!!!

« previous entry | next entry »
Jun. 13th, 2005 | 10:35 am
気持ち: excited excited
音楽: Silence in the morning....

Okay, I was surfing Xanga and I came across this and I wanted to share with everyone!!! Please take the time to read it and comment back on what you perceive from it. Do you agree with the text, or disagree??

Totalmoncome: You will totally love this!!! you better read it!!!ちゃんと
読め


1_warrior: I think that you would be interested in this one too!!! Wow!! Okay here we go: Stolen product..... Why nice guys are often time LOSERS.....

You hear it all the time: "He was such a NICE Guy, and she's such a Heartless Bitch for dumping him."

I get letters from self-professed Nice Guys, complaining that women must WANT to be treated like shit, because THEY, the "Nice Guy" have failed repeatedly in relationships. This is akin to the false logic that "Whales are mammals. Whales live in the sea. Therefore, all mammals live in the sea."

If you have one bad relationship after another, the only common denominator is YOU. Think about it.

What's wrong with Nice Guys? The biggest problem is that most Nice Guys (tm) are hideously insecure. They are so anxious to be liked and loved that they do things for other people to gain acceptance and attention, rather than for the simply pleasure of giving. You never know if a Nice Guy really likes you for who you are, or if he has glommed onto you out of desperation because you actually payed some kind of attention to him.

Nice Guys exude insecurity -- a big red target for the predators of the world. There are women out there who are "users" -- just looking for a sucker to take advantage of. Users home-in on "Nice Guys", stroke their egos, take them for a ride, add a notch to their belts, and move on. It's no wonder so many Nice Guys complain about women being horrible, when the so often the kind of woman that get's attracted to them is the lowest form of life...

Self-confident, caring, decent-hearted women find "Nice Guys" to be too clingy, self-abasing, and insecure.

Nice Guys go overboard. They bring roses to a "lets get together for coffee" date. They try to buy her affections with presents and fancy things. They think they know about romance, but their timing is all wrong, and they either come-on too strong, too hard and too fast, OR, they are so shy and unassertive, that they hang around pretending to be "friends", in the hope that somehow, someway, they will get the courage up to ask her out for a "date".

They are so desperate to please that they put aside their own needs, and place the object of their desire on a pedestal. Instead of appreciating her, they worship her. We are only human, and pedestals are narrow, confining places to be -- not to mention the fact that we tend to fall off of them.

They cling to her, and want to be "one" with her for fear that if she is out of sight, she may disappear or become attracted to someone else. A Nice Guy often has trouble with emotional intimacy, because he believes that if she learns about the REAL person inside, she will no longer love him.

Nice Guys are always asking HER to make the decisions. They think it's being equitable, but it puts an unfair burden of responsibility on her, and gives him the opportunity to blame her if the decision was an unwise one.

Nice Guys rarely speak up when something bothers them, and rarely state clearly what it is they want, need and expect. They fear that any kind of conflict might spell the end of the relationship. Instead of comprimising and negotiating, they repeatedly "give in". When she doesn't appreciate their sacrifice, they will complain that, "Everything I did, I did for her.", as if this somehow elevates them to the status of martyrs. A woman doesn't want a martyr. She wants an equal, caring, adult partner.

Nice Guys think that they will never meet anyone as special as she is. They use their adoration as a foundation for claiming that "no one will ever love her as much as I do." Instead of being a profound statement of their devotion, this is a subtle, but nasty insult. It is akin to saying to her: "You are a difficult person, and only *I* can ever truly love you, so be thankful I'm here."

The nice guy -needs- to believe that he is the best person for the object of his desires, because otherwise his insecurities will overrun him with jealousies and fear. The truth of the matter is that there are many people out there who can be a good match for her. We rarely stop loving people we truly care about. Even if we no longer continue the relationship, the feelings will continue... But love isn't mutually exclusive. We can (and do) love many people in our lives, and romantic love is really no different. Though he may love her immensely, there will likely be other people who have loved her just as much in her past, and will love her just as much in the future. The irony of it all is: "Who would want to go out with someone who was inherintly unlovable anyways?"

More than loving the woman in his life, a Nice Guy NEEDS her. "She is my Life, my only source of happiness..." YECH! What kind of a burden is that to place on her? That SHE has to be responsible for YOUR happiness? Get a grip!

Another mistake Nice Guys make is to go after "hard luck" cases. They deliberately pick women with neuroses, problems, and personality disorders, because Nice Guys are "helpers". A Nice Guy thinks that by "helping" this woman, it will make him a better, more lovable person. He thinks it will give him a sense of accomplishment, and that she will appreciate and love him more, for all his efforts and sacrifice. He is usually disappointed by the results.

This ultimately boils down to the fact that Nice Guys don't like themselves. Is it any wonder women don't like them? In order to truly love someone else, you must first love yourself. Too often Nice Guys mistake obsession for "love".

Get this Guys: INSECURITY ISN'T SEXY. IT'S A TURNOFF.

You don't have to be an ego-inflated, arrogant jerk. You just have to LIKE yourself. You have to know what you want out of life, and go after it. Only then will you be attractive to the kind of woman with whom a long-term relationship is possible.

Link | Purr | Share


Comments {16}

From: twizzlertwit
Date: Jun. 13th, 2005 11:17 pm (UTC)
Link


I agree. It seems to me there's a difference between guys who are nice and nice guys. A guy who is nice is good, but like the article said the typical "nice guy" is way too clingy and needy and insecure which frankly creeps me out for the most part.

Reply | Thread


hisensei808

From: hisensei808
Date: Jun. 14th, 2005 12:07 am (UTC)
Link

Being a "Nice guy" myself, do not view myself as clingy, really I don't. NOr am I insecure!! There are, as there usually is, bits and pieces of the article that I find flawing. There are many questions I have in regards to the article, and I do not find it fair to generalize all "nice guys" as clingy and everything the article states. Be honest, I have an enough difficult time trying to meet someone, now with an article like this going around, it would make me appear to be "clingy and insecure." Fact of the matter is, I am neither of them. I just like to do what I like to do for the woman I love. I also argue, what degree of the relationship are we looking at here?? Beginning, three months, a year, three years?? Think about it, if two people were in a relationship for three years, I think the mindset would be different, and I could understand the "insecurity" upon the end of the relationship, however... after three months... That's a diffferent story.

Reply | Parent | Thread


From: twizzlertwit
Date: Jun. 14th, 2005 12:18 am (UTC)
Link


I agree with you, which is why I think there's a difference between being a guy that is nice and a "nice guy" as the article talks about. Guys who are just nice aren't clingy or needy as the article talks about. They're just generally nice and obviously at the beginning of any relationship it helps when both individuals are nice lol.

I also think the article fails to point out that the same can be said for "nice girls". It really lays more in the motivations for the niceness and what I thought was particularly true about the article was part they mentioned about some relying solely on someone else for their own happiness. That's a lot to put on someone and I've heard so many people say things like "without you I have nothing in my life". It's that sort of mentality that's particularly unappealing.

Reply | Parent | Thread


hisensei808

From: hisensei808
Date: Jun. 14th, 2005 12:55 am (UTC)
Link

That's why I totally like you perspective on this article. yes, you are right about missing the nice girls aspect of society. there are women who are guilty of the same crime and that is well, sad, hahaha. Anyway, thanks for the comments!!

Reply | Parent | Thread


From: twizzlertwit
Date: Jun. 14th, 2005 01:09 am (UTC)
Link


Anytime! I like your idea for having discussion topics in your entries.

Reply | Parent | Thread


From: 1warrior
Date: Jun. 13th, 2005 11:52 pm (UTC)
Link


Oh man. I have a "nice guy" friend. Man, he's in for the disappoint of his life. This girl friend of mine is pregnant with this total jerks baby, and they always hang out together. He's totally not seeing what's happening. My girl friend thinks its funny like ha ha ha, that he follows her around like a little dog. I think its disgusting! But they're both friends of mine, so i just watch it happen. I think he just needs to learn on his own.

Lol, oh, man, I'm gonna share this!

Reply | Thread


hisensei808

From: hisensei808
Date: Jun. 14th, 2005 12:11 am (UTC)
Link

pregnant!! whoa!!

I fear what would happen next seriously. Does she like hime??? Are the feeling mutual?? If they are not, then, yeah he is in for a diappointment. But if not, and she loves him back, different senario. Okay, in this juerks situation, heis what the article states. Apparently, he feels he needs her to justify his own existance (perhaps that is whyshe is pregnant??) Don't know, but still ooooooo. Persoanlly, I have taken small offense to this article because it states that a man like me, is clingy, insecure because I am a nice guy. News for the world, I am neither of them!!! hahaha. Anyway, good article for discusion.

Reply | Parent | Thread


From: 1warrior
Date: Jun. 14th, 2005 12:23 am (UTC)
Link


Yeah. She hates the jerk, but loves him to. He's 30, and refuses to move out to an aprtment of his own. She's 19. She likes the nice guy, but she wants lots of sex and he won't give any. So she says he doesn't want sex until marriage, and she can't have that. She also thinks that she should be miserable for life. Because after all, no one has really been kind to her. Her parents are cruel to her most of the time, so she reasons, that everyone told her she would be a failure, she might as well be. She hopes that her jerk overcontrolling boyfriend, who won't let her be around her friends, that he won't be like this to their children. As for the nice guy, he doesn't realize he's fighting a losing battle.

LOL, Idk, I find it hilarous. I also figured out, so Ooo that's why I'm attracted to jerks. Confidence. I see...

I knew a nice guy tho, who wasn't insecure tho, he was cool. He was the only guy, I know to this day who wasn't clingy, insecure or annoying.

Reply | Parent | Thread


hisensei808

From: hisensei808
Date: Jun. 14th, 2005 01:00 am (UTC)
Link

Actuallly, that falls more into emotional abuse. The guy is really taking advantage of your friend's emotional background. I fear that may even lead to physical abuse because she is buying into it already. Scary. I hope she wakes up from the nightmare she is living in, or heading to!!


Well,I am glad that u know of "nice guys" who are not what the article states. Personally, I was shocked to read it and could not leave it untouched withour an arguement. hahaha

Reply | Parent | Thread


From: 1warrior
Date: Jun. 14th, 2005 06:08 am (UTC)
Link


Oh, she knows. She told me. She wishes it were physical abuse, because at least she could handle it better.

LOL

Reply | Parent | Thread


shinjitsunouta

From: totalmonochrome
Date: Jun. 14th, 2005 01:48 am (UTC)
Link

んー。Interesting readっと思う。本真にどっかに読んだ事ある気がする。(笑)多分ああいうコラムだと思う。こんなコラムはいつも一般化いっぱいあるよね。けれど事実も見えるよね、今回のコラム。先生の思考は。

Reply | Thread


shinjitsunouta

From: totalmonochrome
Date: Jun. 14th, 2005 01:51 am (UTC)
Link

I think that these articles with "one size fits all" advice are usually pretty bad. And who, really, is this supposed to benefit? The best way to help someone who obviously suffers from low self-esteem is to berate them, right? 6¬_¬; I dunno. I just find it a little sad that people have such a harsh way of communicating and giving "advice." But I must admit it was an interesting read. Though, like I said above, I get this weird feeling I've read it before. ^^

Reply | Parent | Thread


hisensei808

From: hisensei808
Date: Jun. 14th, 2005 02:08 am (UTC)
Link

OMG, I totally agree with you!! But, berating someone with low self-esteem will only justifythe fact that they are what they believe they are. Someone with low self esteem needs to come into turns on their own, there really is nothing that we can do to change them. Argh, jjust chatted with TM, found out it was a sarcastic comment!!! haha, see, the damage we do to ourselves with articles like this??? seriously!! Someone clearly needs to rethink the reason for writing this nonsense!!!

Reply | Parent | Thread


yamkaori

From: yamkaori
Date: Jun. 14th, 2005 08:46 am (UTC)
Link

that's really interesting!!i agree with almost all words on there.

and finaly,it means that "nice guy" is the worst guy?and i want to add some of words to this.
>Nice Guys are "helpers".
yeah,that's right,and i wanna say that some of "helpers" want to conquer another one,to make him have a self-conciouness.so they want a weak girl that they can hundle her really easily.my dad was like that!! :P though of course,he was not nice for me.

btw,now i want to make a community to talikng about love,not just a sex....:DDDD

Reply | Thread


From: 1warrior
Date: Jun. 23rd, 2005 11:46 pm (UTC)
Link


a friend of mine posted this:

Ode to the Nice Guys
This rant was written for the Wharton Undergraduate Journal

This is a tribute to the nice guys. The nice guys that finish last, that never become more than friends, that endure hours of whining and bitching about what assholes guys are, while disproving the very point. This is dedicated to those guys who always provide a shoulder to lean on but restrain themselves to tentative hugs, those guys who hold open doors and give reassuring pats on the back and sit patiently outside the changing room at department stores. This is in honor of the guys that obligingly reiterate how cute/beautiful/smart/funny/sexy their female friends are at the appropriate moment, because they know most girls need that litany of support. This is in honor of the guys with open minds, with laid-back attitudes, with honest concern. This is in honor of the guys who respect a girl?s every facet, from her privacy to her theology to her clothing style.

This is for the guys who escort their drunk, bewildered female friends back from parties and never take advantage once they?re at her door, for the guys who accompany girls to bars as buffers against the rest of the creepy male population, for the guys who know a girl is fishing for compliments but give them out anyway, for the guys who always play by the rules in a game where the rules favor cheaters, for the guys who are accredited as boyfriend material but somehow don?t end up being boyfriends, for all the nice guys who are overlooked, underestimated, and unappreciated, for all the nice guys who are manipulated, misled, and unjustly abandoned, this is for you.

This is for that time she left 40 urgent messages on your cell phone, and when you called her back, she spent three hours painstakingly dissecting two sentences her boyfriend said to her over dinner. And even though you thought her boyfriend was a chump and a jerk, you assured her that it was all ok and she shouldn?t worry about it. This is for that time she interrupted the best killing spree you?d ever orchestrated in GTA3 to rant about a rumor that romantically linked her and the guy she thinks is the most repulsive person in the world. And even though you thought it was immature and you had nothing against the guy, you paused the game for two hours and helped her concoct a counter-rumor to spread around the floor. This is also for that time she didn?t have a date, so after numerous vows that there was nothing ?serious? between the two of you, she dragged you to a party where you knew nobody, the beer was awful, and she flirted shamelessly with you, justifying each fit of reckless teasing by announcing to everyone: ?oh, but we?re just friends!? And even though you were invited purely as a symbolic warm body for her ego, you went anyways. Because you?re nice like that.

Reply | Thread


From: 1warrior
Date: Jun. 23rd, 2005 11:47 pm (UTC)
Link



The nice guys don?t often get credit where credit is due. And perhaps more disturbing, the nice guys don?t seem to get laid as often as they should. And I wish I could logically explain this trend, but I can?t. From what I have observed on campus and what I have learned from talking to friends at other schools and in the workplace, the only conclusion I can form is that many girls are just illogical, manipulative bitches. Many of them claim they just want to date a nice guy, but when presented with such a specimen, they say irrational, confusing things such as "oh, he?s too nice to date" or "he would be a good boyfriend but he?s not for me" or "he already puts up with so much from me, I couldn?t possibly ask him out!" or the most frustrating of all: "no, it would ruin our friendship." Yet, they continue to lament the lack of datable men in the world, and they expect their too-nice-to-date male friends to sympathize and apologize for the men that are jerks. Sorry, guys, girls like that are beyond my ability to fathom. I can?t figure out why the connection breaks down between what they say (I want a nice guy!) and what they do (I?m going to sleep with this complete ass now!). But one thing I can do, is say that the nice-guy-finishes-last phenomenon doesn?t last forever. There are definitely many girls who grow out of that train of thought and realize they should be dating the nice guys, not taking them for granted. The tricky part is finding those girls, and even trickier, finding the ones that are single.

So, until those girls are found, I propose a toast to all the nice guys. You know who you are, and I know you?re sick of hearing yourself described as ubiquitously nice. But the truth of the matter is, the world needs your patience in the department store, your holding open of doors, your party escorting services, your propensity to be a sucker for a pretty smile. For all the crazy, inane, absurd things you tolerate, for all the situations where you are the faceless, nameless hero, my accolades, my acknowledgement, and my gratitude go out to you. You do have credibility in this society, and your well deserved vindication is coming.

I did not write this and won't try and take credit for it. I read it and thought it was wonderful so I posted it here for more people to read. If you want to go read it online or send the link to a friend here it is: http://www.stwing.upenn.edu/~jenf/writing/rant04.html

Reply | Thread